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CBR500R Primmed ver.2 - mod to the max

42K views 82 replies 16 participants last post by  tothezenith 
#1 · (Edited)
Some of you might be familiar with my bike going back a few years now. Things have changed a bit since and I reckon time for a new thread.

'My Garage' has some hyperlinks to some of the other mods done.
Before all the nay say'ers get up in arms with the "why bother" posts, I do it cause I love mechanics, to learn, and basically because I find it enjoyable... Plus being single helps to throw coin at things other than T&A. If I had a higher capacity bike, I'd still be doing the same things, so no need for any negativity.

So the latest foray into mods... There's been a few "race engine build" threads started, but to date none completed; here's to changing that.
The most recent add-ons have been the addition of custom ground high-lift cams and the IXIL race spec header, so most definitely has to have dyno tuned after install.
The dyno tuner was very knowledgeable and dealt with a handful of CBR500s in his time, was keen to see what this little bike can actually do with a proper tickle. He did quite a number of runs with different configss to find the best combo, not just for top-end but all round tractability. Because my modifications have been progressed over time, and through the course of changes I'd been doing my own tuning via the DynoJet AutoTune, there is no base run available. The "base-run" line in the dyno image below as the tune as it was at that stage.

The dyno run was done at sea level with ambient temperatures of ~22*C. Just completed major 25K kilometer service (26K on the odo) days before; so new plugs and all new fluids (Honda 10W-30 oil).
Some of the key outcomes of the dyno work:
-1.5-2hp gain having the slip-on baffle installed... a little back pressure can be good.
-'potentially' a couple more hp can be gained with increasing the size of the air filter inlet hole
-Interestingly, most of the fuel map has less fuel input at any given rpm. (Don't get confused thinking stock runs rich, there's more dynamics at play with this)

Base line runs of stock bikes he said, and can also be found comparatively from other sources on the internet, yield averages at the wheel of 42-43hp and 28-29ft-lb torque.

My dyno chart:

To help make things easier though, I've taken 4 different stock dyno results sourced from the internet, plotted them in Excel and then took the average of them and charted alongside the results from my figures, and derived the below comparative results. Note, my engine has Rev X-Tend enabled to 9600rpm, cut-out for stock is 9100.


So how does my bike feel these days?
It's got more pull than a wild Bangkok night!
With 32ft-lb available from 3600rpm rising to a peak of 36ft-lb between 6600-7800rpm, I can pretty much use one gear higher even with a taller 38T sprocket.
In 6th gear doing 70kph at ~4K rpm it will accelerate to 100kph in under 4 Mississippi - yes, that is an accurate measurement :p
The relaxed riding rev range, i.e. grandma riding commuting duties, is between 2500 and 4000rpm; 3rd & 4th gears has plenty of pull even as low as 2000rpm.
And when you feel like getting on it, it's like it has a little power band after 6K, from that to 6600, it jumps 4ft-lb... you do notice it, thinking "oh hello!" 7K, 8K, 9K, oh that grin factor :D

Now with the baffle in, it's quieter than before, which is nice when you just want to cruise. And with the better fuel map, I'm anticipating a reduction in fuel consumption too, well, so long as I can log a full tank run without getting too excited with the throttle.

Here's what it's looking like these days







 
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#2 ·
Me likes...
A few accents are bit too much of a bling for me - but that's only me and the most important that you like it this way. In genereal I can only congratulate.
One can see that you really care for this bike.
Thanks for showing the community what can be done with the engine with bolt-on stuff it is a new ference from now on.
 
#3 · (Edited)
@Oyabun the cam specs may be hard to acquire, especially seeing they are installed now. The company didn't have them when I asked. I'd gone to them with the specs from the Daniel Crower website, they said they "wouldn't be able to grind stock ones to those specs, but they'll give 'em a bit more lift and in the grind process will probably get a little more duration too".
I only had a vernier gauge to get my own measurements before I put them in.
Intake heel-to-toe is 0.16mm smaller
Exhaust heel-to-toe is 0.30mm smaller
Based on the change in shims sizes, the tuner reckons the rockers are about a 1.6 ratio; so it's a pretty mild cam. Considering that, I'm quite impressed with the results.

Refer attached the PC-V map from the tuner.
This is for engine with:
Camshafts as noted above
port matched exhaust outlets
mildly ported and polished throttle bodies
IXIL decat race header
Yoshimura R-77 slip-on with baffle installed
PAIR system removed
K&N air filter
PC-V Rev X-Tend enabled to 9600rpm
Tuned at sea level with RON95 fuel.

----for reference---
the DCR cam specs are:
.355" intake /.355" exhaust lift
.165" cam lift intake and exhaust
226 duration intake and exhaust
.012" intake / .014" exhaust clearance
lobe centerline intake 106
lobe centerline exhaust 104
 

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#8 ·
so after having a good 280km ride yesterday to really get a feel of the results; about 60%city, 30%highway, 10fun, used 9.8L or 3.5L/100km. Will need to get more sample data, but from this run will say there is no loss in economy, if anything slightly better than what I was getting previously, typically 3.6-3.7L/100km.
With the baffle in it is quieter, but to be honest I don't really like the sound; line someone's put a duck's bill on a farting hippo, in the pursuit of best output though, I'll live with it.
That 4sec mississippi count 70-100 must've been in 5th not 6th previously mentioned. Geez it's got low down pull, I'm going to have to get my camera on too do some test runs to be able to get accurate figures. The grin factor us awesome though :)
 
#11 ·
Interesting... although I don't think for the not-so-common mods done on my bike that a mail-in reflash would be ideal. Once you start going above and beyond the typical bolt-ons, it really requires a proper dyno session. Certainly for the usual slip-ons, full exhaust, air filter, changes they have sufficient experience to know the best tweaks though.
 
#13 · (Edited)
Got the bike back from the dyno today following the touch up tune after modifying the airbox as described in the high flow airbox mod thread.
It loses 0.5-1.hp at 3300-4200rpm; gains 1-2hp 4500-6200 and again 8200-9600rpm, with the other ranges on par with prior.
A bit of a difference in the maps from before and after, with after being leaned out even more than standard.
Map file attached for those that are interested.

Not too bad of a gain for just making the airbox intake hole larger.
Note I had to swap from K&N pod style filter to Sprint filter which is of the oem design.

 

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#15 ·
hard to say definitively. A while back there was debate whether running with or without the funnel did anything even on stock engines. The first tune a couple weeks ago, the tuner did find running without the funnel was better for my setup, and the bigger bike with this setup even better.

There is merit to stay there is a limitation with the airbox inlet. How much is gained by modifying it would be exponential to other mods done. The lid to the airbox (excluding funnel) is only $4 from the dealership, so a pretty cheap thing for anyone to give it a go.
 
#16 ·
doing commuting duties, and temptation is rife to go the long way home via a bit of mountain pass. Loving how much go the bike has these days and does make me wonder... is it currently the fastest CBR500R in my town, state, country, world?
Am certainly finding out what it is capable of, and glad I can contribute to the community to inspire others :)
 
#17 · (Edited)
I'm just now getting into this bike. I actually did not know of its existence until a couple of weeks ago. I stumbled upon it while researching the 300cc Ninja and Honda to use as a second bike. LOL
Now I'm hooked.

So, with my very limited knowledge, I say...you just may be the king dick of the CB 500 world.
And that covers the entire planet, maybe even the universe.

Congratulations, I raise my glass to you. :beers
 
#19 · (Edited)
CBR500R 1/4mile

one of the clips from last night at the drag strip.
Note haven't reset the shift lift since the mods yet, so it's triggering about 800rpm too early still. This is only my second (and a half, cause one other night got rained out after only one run) time taking a bike down the quarter, so don't expect a stellar performance. Can definitely go faster, next time I'd like to run it with some accessories removed and less fuel to reduce weight, and to swap the sprocket and chain back to the factory 41T for better comparison; the best report I've read is a 13.798@96mph, but most others I've read are getting in the 13.9-14.1s@88-92mph. My best on the night was a 13.375@97.62mph; I believe with less weight and sprocket change a 13.2@100 is definitely acheivable.
 
#21 ·
Not wet, was a perfectly clear night; that sheen is from a well prepped track, sooo sticky you had to make sure to tippy-toe because flat footing you'd stick to the track.

Looking forward to end-Oct/start-Sep to do one of those advanced rider road&track training courses too, so will get some track work clips hopefully as well.
 
#28 ·
BTW. I found confirmation, that the stock Honda CB400R pistons are giving 0.3 extra CR and up to .05mm overbore to the 500...
well that's interesting!
As I approach the 30K mark on this bike, I'm start to think I need to look where I want to be in the future. I've put sooo much time and money into this little thing I don't think I could stand to let it go. Eventually I want to get a bigger bike, but that'll be something for taking offroad on camping adventures. I reckon I'll hold onto this thing for the long run and it's so good on fuel and still heaps of fun to throw around. Looking at 2nd hand engines, can get some very low km complete engine & box for $1000-2000. I'm thinking later next year when I move out to a place with a bigger garage I could work on that spare engine, those pistons you mention sound like a good option, and was going to port & polish the heads while I'm at it. Then when the current engine starts feeling tired, I'll have an engine ready to go that has a bottom end to match the other things I've done to improve flow :)
 
#29 · (Edited)
Just did some number crunching on your data provided with the dyno runs.
I calculated the difference between the baseline and new power available at certain RPMs in percentage of the stock or baseline performance.
It is _very_ impressive. you start off from 21% - reaching almost 30%@5500 so got a really nice boost at midrange or crusising speed. Then tapering down a bit reaching a local minimum @7500 with 26% gain and then raising again over 35% at cutoff. Nothingvrobbe shy of.
Really interested if the Velocity stacks are giving anything to this - but very impressive already. Congrats.
 

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#31 · (Edited)
Mountain run on the new rubber

So following on from my tyre comparison thread, here’s a little video of a section of the run we did on Saturday. Video covers the section of road below. Love this road, it's actually 30km long, but this is the sweetest, longest twisty section. So many turns and just a well laid piece of tarmac; always brings a smile to my dial!

P.S. sorry about the audio, I'm yet to mod my cam to get use an externam mic
 
#36 · (Edited)
So doing a frame-by-frame step through of the two videos I got from the drag nights last month... from the looks of things, the best I can make out with the poor quality of the video is one was a fraction (like 3-5 frames) below and the other a fraction above 5 seconds for the 0-100kph. I need to work on the launch, it's should be capable of mid-high 4's really.
Only the one run (linked above) I kept on it to the 160kph mark and that shows about 14.8secs.
I reckon the addition of the quickshifter definitely will improve those and will be heading back to the dragstrip within the next month.
This time I'll remember to set the video camera on high-res :-/
 
#37 · (Edited)
Back from the dyno after installing the Motormaxx velocity stacks... almost but not quite. Sorry @Oyabun but gotta wait another week to get definitive results.
Across the board the bike netted lower (between 1-2hp across the entire range) the with the factory stacks. He was expecting not as higher gain back-to-back seeing it was about 5*C warmer than the original run. But after some pondering we've realised this comparison run was not with identical setups. Since the last run, as you know I fitted those new Dunlop Q3 tyres as the old Michelin PP3s had worn out after 14K kms. We had a look on the tyre comparisons chart in the comparison shoot out and found the Q3 to be a taller profile tyre to the PP3, and considering my PP3 where almost bald, the difference between the two would be even greater. So with the change in tyres I've effectively altered the gearing of the bike. He mentioned that he sees a 10hp loss with his CBR600RR going from road to slick tyres, even without considering circumferences, the slick is a noticeably heavier tyre; so weight would also be a factor for the difference.

So, plan is to swap back in the factory velocity stacks and do another run next week. We'll then be able to see the percentage change between the baseline run done last month and how changes of temp and tyre have affected things. Using those percentage values we'll then offset the newest dyno run to yield a more accurate back-to-back comparison.
He's also going to provide me with a full data download (hp, torque, speed, AFRs...) of the figures for all my runs, so I can do some more analysis and plot them onto some charts.
 
#38 ·
@tothezenith heh ... this is getting really complicated ... one would not even think there will be such differences for things like tire circumference, weight and air temperature ... i guess it adds up ... either way, with all the things combined and a loss of 1-2hp, that would mean, that if your setup was stock, the gain with identical conditions should be about 7 HP(?) from the current run and if we count with the gains shown on the motomaxx charts? (2 back to the baseline and about 5 gain) which would maybe correspond with the road to slick theory on the 600 and 10 hp loss (as the q3 are not quite slicks, but have noticeably more rubber than the pp3)

so the waiting game begins again :) will you bring the stacks there and change them on the spot?
 
#39 ·
hard to postulate in the variances @_Yamato so I'm not counting things till its all tested. Got the bike back at the moment, and won't take much to swap the stacks, so will do it tomorrow and drop the bike off on in the week. I know last run it was also on the back of a fresh oil change, so to rule that aspect out also, I'll throw in some fresh oil too.
 
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